$15 table centerpiece

OK this is why I don't post on Flower Chat more often.......I have a little problem with tact. But today I am going to throw caution to the wind and probably end another multi-post thread like I did last time I couldn't contain myself.....And I love Flower Chat and I love, love, love these thought provoking posts but I just gotta say...

Plattsburgh - WHY IN THE HECK ARE YOU GIVING THIS LADY THE TIME OF DAY.......JUST WHY???????? CONDESCENDING, NO MONEY, PICKY AND AT THIS POINT YOU ARE 2 LONG CONSULTATIONS INTO IT AND SHE HASN'T EVEN SAID YES.... I would be fuming at this point even if she were buying 100.00 centerpieces. I would NEVER do a lengthy second consult without a signed contract and especially not on a 500.00 job.

Just are you kidding me?????? Run and if you are board read these reviews on me.

http://www.projectwedding.com/vendor/show/flower-allie

I have more positive reviews on here than any retail florist in the US and I am all about customer service and pleasing the customer but this is just CRAZY.......
 
I appreciate your thoughts on this Allie. I'd be more than fuming too. But how do you bow out of a job without sounding like a jerk? I just don't know how to do that.
 
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I often don't know how either Shannon and for that reason I take jobs I shouldn't sometimes. I also get talked down in consultations and so when they call to book I say I am already booked. My employees underbid jobs a lot too and then I have them say we are already booked.....I guess why this thread is so frustrating to me is that it just feels like a fellow florist is investing so much time and energy for no gain and I just want to jump through the computer and fire her customer for her. On the other hand is always good to have an inexpensive centerpiece idea that looks good and I now have one.
 
Bring up the contract and payment due date. Tell her you can't order the product without these and to get the items needed at this price, you have to order by a certain date (not your actual have-to-order-by date because she'll take as much time as you give her). "I'm sorry to put such a deadline on you, but if we don't order by xxxx, I can't guarantee the colors (or flowers, or whatever you think will make her the most anxious), and we both want your event to be perfect." if she says the group only pays after the event, you can either request a credit card to authorize OR tell her that since you work with a perishable product and you are ordering specifically for her event, that it's the shop policy to have pre-payment. (I'd go with #2--she's a PITA.). If she won't go for this, you're off the hook. 'shop policies' are wonderful things to fall back on!

I have a client that has regularly ordered from me for over 4 years now. Not once has she seemed happy with my estimates or ideas. Yet she still comes back. I've finally decided that it's not me--it's ALL her. The last time, she brought me a pic of what she wanted and when I told her it was out of her requested budget because of the number of flowers needed to create that look (5x5 cube vase, all roses, no foliage for 60" rounds), she tried to argue with me about how many it would take...because you could clearly see 12 roses in the pic. Of course, she was only looking at the front side, and only a Eskimo roses would work for her (she would have complained if the worse wasn't EXACTLY what she thought a rose should look like). She also told me that hydranges 'cheapen' the look of an arrangement. (sigh)
 
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OK this is why I don't post on Flower Chat more often.......I have a little problem with tact. But today I am going to throw caution to the wind and probably end another multi-post thread like I did last time I couldn't contain myself.....And I love Flower Chat and I love, love, love these thought provoking posts but I just gotta say...

Plattsburgh - WHY IN THE HECK ARE YOU GIVING THIS LADY THE TIME OF DAY.......JUST WHY???????? CONDESCENDING, NO MONEY, PICKY AND AT THIS POINT YOU ARE 2 LONG CONSULTATIONS INTO IT AND SHE HASN'T EVEN SAID YES.... I would be fuming at this point even if she were buying 100.00 centerpieces. I would NEVER do a lengthy second consult without a signed contract and especially not on a 500.00 job.

Just are you kidding me?????? Run and if you are board read these reviews on me.

http://www.projectwedding.com/vendor/show/flower-allie

I have more positive reviews on here than any retail florist in the US and I am all about customer service and pleasing the customer but this is just CRAZY.......

I thank you for your opinion and honesty. That's what I love about FC. Wow nice and alot of reviews! We have on occasion had people write us about excellent service and/or arrangements and I've kindly asked them to leave us a review of their experience with us. Some have and some haven't.
We are a small florist. A couple part time employees and my mother and I as owners that's it. We have on average 7-10 deliveries a day and my mother and I do our own deliveries. Our name is Plattsburgh Flower Market and we bought the business as a turnkey flower shop 7yrs ago. We immediately made it both a market and florist because we knew people wanted flowers delivered and arranged like a florist does. The previous owners had very minimal markup on flowers, but offered no delivery, no wedding-event, nor design, or special ordering anything. No headache's about the right shade of this flower or that flower didn't come in tall enough. What the customer saw is what they got. Things were easy. They did well! Then grocery stores started carrying flowers and our local Price Chopper grocery store opened their Central Market florist and really hurt us. We weren't the cheapest game in town anymore. I know that isn't exactly the best thing but around here where people don't make alot of money, I feel being cheapest in town has helped us. We get so many phone calls saying "you're the cheapest by far among other florists in town so I'll order through you" The grocery stores have decent size bunches of all one type of flower for $5 and offer 3/$15. We are constantly being compared to them so we don't offer many bunches for this reason. We offer flowers by the stem, but of course they are more expensive than Price Choppers. Our shop is Bucket shop style pretty much. With the previous owners people could purchase vases/containers and flowers but we would not design. Everyone has always seen it as a market so it has been extremely difficult advertising and getting through customers heads that we are a full service florist now except we don't do wiring of flowers. People see "market" and think farmers market or garden center where you can purchase flower seeds, geranium hanging baskets, etc. We need to find a way to inexpensively advertise that we can design and offer flowers for funerals, weddings, special events etc. We have even made up an artificial fruit basket and placed it on the counter to show that we can make fruit/gourmet baskets and that's helped get notice. We have 2 sidewalk signs that we place out by this busy intersection we are on with different sayings on each side that we change frequently to explain what we do.
The reason why I'm giving her the time of day is I guess on some level I'm hoping that people will take notice of the centerpieces and ask who did those and I'm sure most of the 350 people who are there might not of even heard of us, nor think we do arrangements and stop in or call or want to check us out, but I see from a majority of the posts here that probably won't be the case, but got to give it a try. How do you advertise that you do can do nice event work if you are never given a chance? How do you advertise this service? I mean for wedding work, vendors can go to a bridal expo/show. No one listens to radio ads or reads newspapers anymore because tried both to no luck. We are located on a busy street corner where we can be missed with hectic traffic. Once customers stop into our shop they comment on how nice our shop is that they've never seen a shop as nice as ours with that much of a selection. We don't have wreaths all over the walls or silk dried product everywhere. We sell flowers and display them all over our shop.
If we turned everyone away with a low budget we'd have little to 0 business. We have no corporate accounts and haven't had much to any event work. At this time we don't offer billing. We want to be paid on the spot and not have to hunt people down for money. So far it's been a fairly quiet Jan. for us so we've been able to get a good jump on Valentine's day and planning all that.
I just really want to grow weddings, events, etc...the places where people supposedly have the money.
 
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The reason why I'm giving her the time of day is I guess on some level I'm hoping that people will take notice of the centerpieces and ask who did those and I'm sure most of the 350 people who are there might not of even heard of us, nor think we do arrangements and stop in or call or want to check us out, but I see from a majority of the posts here that probably won't be the case, but got to give it a try. How do you advertise that you do can do nice event work if you are never given a chance? How do you advertise this service? I mean for wedding work, vendors can go to a bridal expo/show. No one listens to radio ads or reads newspapers anymore because tried both to no luck. We are located on a busy street corner where we can be missed with hectic traffic. Once customers stop into our shop they comment on how nice our shop is that they've never seen a shop as nice as ours with that much of a selection. We don't have wreaths all over the walls or silk dried product everywhere. We sell flowers and display them all over our shop.
If we turned everyone away with a low budget we'd have little to 0 business. We have no corporate accounts and haven't had much to any event work. At this time we don't offer billing. We want to be paid on the spot and not have to hunt people down for money. So far it's been a fairly quiet Jan. for us so we've been able to get a good jump on Valentine's day and planning all that.
I just really want to grow weddings, events, etc...the places where people supposedly have the money.

Honestly, I don't think you are very far off at all. Personally, I think alot of the other posts on might be, but at the same time I understand where they are coming from. There is a big difference between how to market yourself in a big city vs a small town. Over my career I have had the opportunity to do both, in multiple different industries, and I can tell you with certainty what works in one, doesn't work in another. When you are in a large city, you can tick a few people off and its no big deal. There are an infinite number of other customers you can market to. In a small town (our town is less than 7k), ticking off one person can be the difference between thriving and going out of business. It sounds like this lady is extremely difficult to deal with, and yes that makes it frusterating, BUT odds are this is also a lady that knows everyone in town and is very vocal about her experience. Sucking it up and making the best of it will very likely be good for your business. Since the event is also for the local hospital, odds are it will be filled with your prime customers (doctors, lawyers, businessmen or women and local dignitaries). Also keep in mind that there is no instant gratification with this type of marketing. Its not like a coupon or daily special where you instantly see the result (or lack there of). This marketing strategy takes time, and commitment. The pay-offs are long term and much bigger than any coupon or advertisement, but it is also the most work for your physically, emotionally and mentally. For this reason, it is easy to dismiss as a waste of time, or not worth it, but in reality you need to ask yourself if you business can afford not to do it?

If I were serious about building my business I would first off forget completely about even trying to make a profit or even break even. IF I were to do this event, I would view it as a marketing expense and proceed accordingly. (It amazes me that florists will hand over tens of thousands of dollars to WS for "marketing" that takes their business from them, yet are so reluctant to market DIRECTLY to their PRIME CUSTOMERS because it will cost them a hundred bucks). Now that doesn't mean it needs to cost a fortune, I would create a modest budget and stick to it. (most of it would be labor/your time) I would also be at the event and use the event to showcase your work, meet people etc. In a small town its all about who you know. The only way to get to know them is to be front and center, to be involved in the community, and to support the people that you want to support you. When I was in a big metro area, I used much different approach to marketing, but in a small town this is critical. It works. I would also suggest joining some service clubs if you don't already; Rotary, Lions, Kiwanis, Big Brother/Big Sister, Chamber of Commerce--whatever interests you the most.

As far as dealing with the difficult lady, I would NOT send her packing or tell her "no". I would just very kindly give her options. Tell her what you can do, and explain that you really appreciate being a part of this event but if you don't have the ability to fulfill her needs you understand. That you enjoy working with her and support her cause, but if she needs to go elsewhere you understand as well. Leave the choice up to her. (Odds are, that will bring her down a few notches--I've used it a few times) If she keeps spitting out ideas, suggest that she give it a few days to think about it and when she decides exactly what she wants to come see you. Explain that once you commit to product orders, they can't be changed, so you want her to be confident in her decision. The more decisions SHE makes, the happier she will be, and the less room there is to blame you!

A fellow business owner in town (VERY successful--and rather wise), who is also very involved in the community was at a meeting with me a few months ago. A similiar conversation to this occured and his advice was that he "never says no". Nomatter what someone asks for he always tells them that he is sure that he can help somehow and gets their contact information. He said he then goes back to his office and stresses about about what he CAN do to help and proceeds accordingly. Again, I can tell you it works. His business volume keeps growing, and they expand every year. He is a part of the fabric in the community and that is very important to being successful in small towns.


I copied and pasted an excerpt from another post/blog because I think it sums everything up very well

5. Don’t fall victim to charity. Charities are like vultures: they smell a dying business from miles away and assure that it will perish. I know several of my readers just gasped. Let me console you. I believe charity is the backbone of life, not just business. I am so anti-corporate and pro-small business that I think charity is one of the important things that differentiate us from big corporate (the United States of Walmart). But charity starts at home as the saying goes. Adapt this principle to your marketing plan: give back to the organizations that contain customers. If an .org wants your charity, does that .org have any employees who do business with you? Consider only donation requests that originate from a personal customer who works for that charity. And to turn this item from the list of marketing don’ts to marketing do’s, here’s the key: your own presence at the event that you are contributing to. Your presence with your product/donation is essential to a donation becoming a marketing tool. If you think enough to donate to a charitable event, make sure your donation is reciprocated with tickets and not a printed thank you in the program (useless).
 
. . Everyone has always seen it as a market so it has been extremely difficult advertising and getting through customers heads that we are a full service florist now except we don't do wiring of flowers. People see "market" and think farmers market or garden center where you can purchase flower seeds, geranium hanging baskets, etc. We need to find a way to inexpensively advertise that we can design and offer flowers for funerals, weddings, special events etc. We have even made up an artificial fruit basket and placed it on the counter to show that we can make fruit/gourmet baskets and that's helped get notice. We have 2 sidewalk signs that we place out by this busy intersection we are on with different sayings on each side that we change frequently to explain what we do.

On a seperate note, have you thought about modifying/supplementing your business name slightly?

Instead of just "Plattsburgh Flower Market" What if you were "Plattsburgh Flower Market AND Floral designs by Sue (or) Arrangements by Cindy" etc etc.

The only cost would be a second or new sign for the outside of your building and a possible redesign of business cards, letterhead etc? You would essentially market it as two businesses under one roof. You have the traditional (and well known) flower market with great values and DIY line, and you have the new "floral design" business geared towards those looking for a full service florist.

Right now you are only marketing your "full service florist" to customers already coming through your door. Odds are, a majority of those customers are coming through your door because they are looking for the best value, DIY flowers. You need to market to the customers that don't shop at your store because they don't know you offer full service. The name and sign modification would not only grab the attention of those driving by, but also would be more appropriate to those looking in phone books or online. Like you said, "flower market" has a certain implication.
 
I think Clarabella makes a lot of great points. And I do agree that when I donate something for advertising I don't worry about making a profit but just making sure the arrangements look good enough to be advertising.

I also had thought just like Clarabelle that you need a tag line added to your name. ...Plattsburgh Flower Market then something catchy about design. I have changed my title to floral stylist and brides just eat it up.

I really enjoyed reading about your business and I went to your website and the loose flowers are beautiful, there is lots of variety and the store is cute. On the other hand the arrangements don't look great. The funeral work is OK but the wedding work looks very dated. I also went to Wedding Wire for your area and there are some really terrific florists with really terrific websites. I think you need a new website with updated designs....I am going to start a thread on this tonight...my opinion is that websites and branding will make or break a business right now.....I think you need to direct your creativity and time towards this and away from Miss 15.00 centerpiece!
 
A couple more thoughts/suggestions. First, you really should consider making a backdrop for when you take pictures of your own work. This can be as simple as a heavy flat bedsheet, or some nice material from the fabric shop. Seeing the clutter and work stations in the background is very distracting to a customer (as a florist, you probably don't notice it--you are too busy focusing on the flowers), but think as a consumer would. It screams "farmers market" and not "professional florist" like you want it to.

Also, i would carefully consider positioning yourself as the "cheap florist" and instead position yourself as the "best value" florist. Instead of having the cheapest prices, I would come just under your competition. For example, your dozen red roses vase is $50. Nelson's Flower Shop (appears to be your closest competition) is $63 for the comparable product. Instead of undercutting them by $13, raise your price to $59.99. Then with some longer stem roses (or more strategic cuts), better filler etc, you could easily make an arrangement that looks twice as big as your competitions AND make more profit for yourself. At that point it would be a win-win. Customers that are looking for the cheapest flowers, will still come to you--you will be cheaper--and those customer generally only need a buck or two to convince them. Customers that are looking for the nicest arrangement for the money, will come to you as well--your arrangement is larger and prettier. Suddenly you have transformed from the cheapest to the "best value".
Compare Nelson's http://www.nelsonflowershop.com/product_detail/330 to this https://www.alwaysdistinctive.com/distinctiveoccasions/product-info.php?pid5.html for a great example.


This industry is all about value to the customer--and value is more than price. Its quality, design, price and service all bundled into one package. If a competitor falls short on design, then you can leap right over them, set your price higher than them and STILL have the "best value". Compare Nelson's half dozen roses http://www.nelsonflowershop.com/product_detail/548
to Bosses half dozen roses (hope you don't mind Boss)
http://www.smithsflowers.com/product_detail/1373
The presentation easily makes it worth the extra $2.95!

That being said, I know how difficult it is to get your website to where you want it. Mine needs a total overhaul, and if all goes well, it will be happening very soon! Spend some time and look around at fellow chatters. There are alot of members on here with GREAT websites. (not WS garbage). I know I have been spending alot of time seeing what I like and don't like from other sites so that my new site will be the best it can possibly be!

Looks like you have a great start and are headed down the right road.....now its all a matter of fine tuning to get to where you want to be!
 
Oh my...thanks all for your thoughts and time. I appreciate the knowledge. As for the photo's, I think you were looking at our portfolio which yes is pictures more from when we first opened 7 yrs ago. I have put some more recent bridal work on our facebook page which I hope to grow. In the navigation bar if you go to floral catalogue those are the arrangements we are selling. Most are John Henry images with some of our own designs. Currently for a background I just have 2 science fair white poster boards I use. I have been experimenting with draping cloths over it. I don't really have any editing programs nor have time to get into all that. I just don't have time to do it all and it gets frustrating. I'm designer/cashier-clerk/phone answerer/shop maintenance/flower processor/web designer/sympathy and bridal consultant/accountant/deliveries at times...I work 10hr days and slightly shorter hours on the weekends but eat & sleep flowers. I'm physically at the shop 62hrs a week I strive to get better, that's why I love FC. I can learn from experienced people. I do have to say we often get a lot of comments on our website saying how much they like it, enjoy it, how informative it is but we are in a very traditional small town. My next goal is to be e-commerce so that we can officially start getting orders from the website and less phone calls. That's a whole another scary avenue I need to research more before just jumping into it. The hosting on our website right now is super cheap and don't think we can spend a whole lot on hosting. I'm talking $20 a month. Well it's a work in progress...I'll get it someday. Ok that's my time for today off to arrange some flowers!
 
You need to make the time! I'm a one woman show too! And I get it done! Picassa is FREE to clean up your photos. You just download it and it's on your computer!


I'm a big fat 40 year old woman- Who 10 years ago didn't even know how to turn on a computer! If I can get this stuff done- anyone can!
 
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a yard or 2 of black velvet hung on a dowel (or in our case stapled to a 1X1 board) makes a great portable back drop.

I was really really cheap in that I used the skirt of an old black velvet formal - it was free and I am cheap. :)
 
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You need to make the time! I'm a one woman show too! And I get it done! Picassa is FREE to clean up your photos. You just download it and it's on your computer!


I'm a big fat 40 year old woman- Who 10 years ago didn't even know how to turn on a computer! If I can get this stuff done- anyone can!

And I'm a moderately sized 58 year old woman who just learned so much regarding taking pics and editing them some also with picasa and how to utilize them on my website as well as social media - facebook, twitter, now google+ etc (and just bought an IPad LOL) Anyone can do it with practice!!!
 
Heart Doctor Lady called back today...now she wants us to purchase 35 vases, she's no longer interested in borrowing, she wants to buy outright (I thought she said she was going to be using 20 of the ones the venue currently has but needed us to provide 15 more?????). She then said to me on the phone today "can you match or beat Michael's price of $3.99 a vase" I told her that no I couldn't that the best I could do would be $5 per vase. She then began to sound like ok I'll get them from Michaels and drop them off to you, but then she changed her tune and said just go ahead and order them it'll be easier to just get them through you. She then states that she has found some curly willow bunches online for $3 a bunch or something and will be dropping them off for me to use, but will still need to purchase another 3 bunches from us????. I'm standing there on the other end of the phone line going...What??? She's trying to nickel and dime this centerpiece down, yet still have us create the designs. I'm waiting for the next part to be well just purchase the flowers and I'll have some hospital volunteers put them together. If she calls again this week I'm putting my foot down and saying "C'mon lady I've been more than patient with you, we are a business and need to be paid for our time/expertise/etc."
 
Time to put up or shut up. Sorry but I know you have a small town but this is way too much. Smile and politely tell her that you have other work to do that will actually make you $$$. Time is money and you have already "donated" too much of you time!!
 
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I had a lady like that back at Christmas. Wanted sample, after sample, after sample, and wanted it now. The picture she had was easily 150.00 centerpiece and her budget was under 35.00 ea. I'm embarrassed to say I flat out told her, this is not McDonald's. She went with someone else. I'm dying to know what they ended up looking like, but sometimes you just got to let it go.
 
Had that today. We got a new womans club that dropped another shop in town and wanted to know what we can do for them. They have been sending "smiley face mums", a huge football mum with a smiley face done on it. We do something similar with our sunflowers. So we showed them that. I ask what they were paying for the smiley mums including delivery...... $10, yep $10 including delivery. I almost fell on the floor. They must grow their own mums. I can't get footballs for less than roses so even with a x2 and the bud vase would push me close to $6. WOW. Anyway, we have decided to use it to market to the other ladies in the club, a great way to get our foot in the door, but we did get her to go $15. Not sure how long we will keep them, it sounds like they change board members each year so it could go either way next election lol.
 
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Heart Doctor Lady called back today...now she wants us to purchase 35 vases, she's no longer interested in borrowing, she wants to buy outright (I thought she said she was going to be using 20 of the ones the venue currently has but needed us to provide 15 more?????). She then said to me on the phone today "can you match or beat Michael's price of $3.99 a vase" I told her that no I couldn't that the best I could do would be $5 per vase. She then began to sound like ok I'll get them from Michaels and drop them off to you, but then she changed her tune and said just go ahead and order them it'll be easier to just get them through you. She then states that she has found some curly willow bunches online for $3 a bunch or something and will be dropping them off for me to use, but will still need to purchase another 3 bunches from us????. I'm standing there on the other end of the phone line going...What??? She's trying to nickel and dime this centerpiece down, yet still have us create the designs. I'm waiting for the next part to be well just purchase the flowers and I'll have some hospital volunteers put them together. If she calls again this week I'm putting my foot down and saying "C'mon lady I've been more than patient with you, we are a business and need to be paid for our time/expertise/etc."

This is insane.

I know I'd just say- "Well, we could use your willow- but the price will remain the same. I have given you a very big discount on the product as well as my labor. But I'd be happy to use your willow."

And when she calls to say her ladies can just put it all together- Tell her the same thing again.

She's a very impractical person. I know that for me time is money- and as much time as she has wasted on this, she could have made the stupid things herself and just literally ordered the single flower from you and plopped the suckers in the vases herself!