Revenge on the OGs

[tomfromcrossroads]

Just a thought...... everytime someone clicks on a OGs pay per click ad on a search engine it costs th OGs $1.00 to $4.00 - however, Search engines are "smart" and after 2 clicks from the same computer on the same day, they will not charge anymore. With that being said... What if every Flower Chat member were to click on all the OGs that are listed in there home town, on all 3 major search engines, from there home computer, office computer and laptop..... that would be thousands of clicks per day... do you think we could put some of them under???? Again - THIS IS JUST A THOUGHT - I don't think we should stoop as low and be unethical and deceptive as the OGs, but the thought of doing this is like "sugar plums dancing in my head". What do you think?:wide::loopyblush:

 

[concord]

I was under the impression they had better ppc rates than that, but I still like the idea.

 

[duanermb]

I don't think we should stoop as low and be unethical and deceptive as the OGs, but the thought of doing this is like "sugar plums dancing in my head". What do you think?:wide::loopyblush:

Emphasis mine: It's called click fraud.

Non-contracting parties

A secondary source of click fraud is non-contracting parties, who are not part of any pay-per-click agreement. This type of fraud is even harder to police, because perpetrators generally cannot be sued for breach of contract or charged criminally with fraud. Examples of non-contracting parties are:

• Competitors of advertisers: These parties may wish to harm a competitor who advertises in the same market by clicking on their ads. The perpetrators do not profit directly but force the advertiser to pay for irrelevant clicks, thus weakening or eliminating a source of competition.

Instead, spend the time learning how to compete properly on AdWords, working on more compelling ad copy for ourselves and developing a brand in our own local markets.

 

[bootcampguy]

I think flower PPC are pricey at the holidays.............on another note........I got a call yesterday from someone who was on a website www.redevelope.com. A new gift site. Put in the keyword for flowers and page after page shows up. One on there 36 roses in vase (SH) i think for 49.99. Does anyone know who their sending through, if not I'll do test purchase. Sorry for the hi-jack

 

[CHR]

ProFlowers parent company, Liberty Media, owns Red Envelope and I'm sure the images on that site are from PF.

About PPCs - clicking on OGs ads can actually help them. The more clicks, the lower their cost with better positioning. Excellent advice from Duane... learn how to craft effective ads and compete in the space.

 

[Doug Munro]

Just a thought...... everytime someone clicks on a OGs pay per click ad on a search engine it costs th OGs $1.00 to $4.00 - however, Search engines are "smart" and after 2 clicks from the same computer on the same day, they will not charge anymore. With that being said... What if every Flower Chat member were to click on all the OGs that are listed in there home town, on all 3 major search engines, from there home computer, office computer and laptop..... that would be thousands of clicks per day... do you think we could put some of them under???? Again - THIS IS JUST A THOUGHT - I don't think we should stoop as low and be unethical and deceptive as the OGs, but the thought of doing this is like "sugar plums dancing in my head". What do you think?:wide::loopyblush:

So when OG's use business practices that are not viewed as above board they are considered "dishonest" and every imaginable slur is used to describe their business ethics. Threads are started outing companies that as little as one individual (often anonymous) feels may be an order gatherer. Talk continues about working with lawmakers and wire services to have rules changed to prevent deceptive and dishonest order gathering practices all in the name of protecting the "real florist" who is trying to compete honestly.

Now we have a suggestion that florists as a group commit an act that by any standards is dishonest and possibly even break the law. For those of you who are considering this ask yourself this

Would you consider it a fair business practice if an in town competitor had relatives phone your shop throughout the holidays on a continuous basis from blocked phone numbers with the goal of preventing you from taking incoming calls?

Would you consider it a fair practice if your competitor had friends park in front of your shop during holidays so that customers could not?

Last but not least, At times I think that if half the thought and energy that is expended on this board to undermine companies considered OG's was spent by some of the contributors to build their own business they would be incredibly successful.

As for me, this Christmas like every other day of the year my energy and that of our staff will be focused on generating business for our own stores and not worrying about the other guy.

 

[Mikey the Flower Guy]

<thumbs up>

 

[concord]

So when OG's use business practices that are not viewed as above board they are considered "dishonest" and every imaginable slur is used to describe their business ethics. Threads are started outing companies that as little as one individual (often anonymous) feels may be an order gatherer. Talk continues about working with lawmakers and wire services to have rules changed to prevent deceptive and dishonest order gathering practices all in the name of protecting the "real florist" who is trying to compete honestly.

Now we have a suggestion that florists as a group commit an act that by any standards is dishonest and possibly even break the law. For those of you who are considering this ask yourself this

Would you consider it a fair business practice if an in town competitor had relatives phone your shop throughout the holidays on a continuous basis from blocked phone numbers with the goal of preventing you from taking incoming calls?

Would you consider it a fair practice if your competitor had friends park in front of your shop during holidays so that customers could not?

Last but not least, At times I think that if half the thought and energy that is expended on this board to undermine companies considered OG's was spent by some of the contributors to build their own business they would be incredibly successful.

As for me, this Christmas like every other day of the year my energy and that of our staff will be focused on generating business for our own stores and not worrying about the other guy.

Tom's was pretty clear that he was just dreaming. I think you're taking him too seriously. Some times it's fun to vent on FC and not get lectured for it. Doesn't mean we aren't making serious efforts to market our business honestly. Jeesh!

 

[anytimeflowers]

Talk continues about working with lawmakers and wire services to have rules changed to prevent deceptive and dishonest order gathering practices all in the name of protecting the "real florist" who is trying to compete honestly.

Just this one little piece. Lawmakers have not passed these laws to protect the "real florist". These laws have been passed to protect the consumer. As in California, when lawmakers misunderstand who the law protects, the law does not get passed.


​

 

[tomfromcrossroads]

as I originally said this is "JUST A THOUGHT" and I posted it to see the many views of other florists. As expected, I heard from "the good, the bad and the ugly" and consider and respect all of your opinions......

 

[Mikey the Flower Guy]

Tom's was pretty clear that he was just dreaming. I think you're taking him too seriously. Some times it's fun to vent on FC and not get lectured for it. Doesn't mean we aren't making serious efforts to market our business honestly. Jeesh!

it's all from tension...it's all good!!

 

[Doug Munro]

Tom's was pretty clear that he was just dreaming. I think you're taking him too seriously. Some times it's fun to vent on FC and not get lectured for it. Doesn't mean we aren't making serious efforts to market our business honestly. Jeesh!

Theres no problem with musing on what could be, however when you publicly state a thought like this you will be subject to public opinion. Imagine if the President publicly stated that his dream would be to clear the deficit in one year by simply confiscating all privately held asset's. As a taxpayer would you brush this off as simply the musing of a single man, or lay awake at night.

What Tom has done with this thread is plant a seed, one that can not serve any real purpose or lead to anything good. Its the kind of thing that is just as likely to be quoted down the road by someone as something those "nuts on FlowerChat" are discussing.

But these are just my thoughts, take them as you will and note I did not preface them with the statement" I am just dreaming".

 

[concord]

. Imagine if the President publicly stated that his dream would be to clear the deficit in one year by simply confiscating all privately held asset's. As a taxpayer would you brush this off as simply the musing of a single man, or lay awake at night..

Good thing Tom isn't the president of the US then!

 

[BOSS]

Imagine if the President publicly stated that his dream would be to clear the deficit in one year by simply confiscating all privately held asset's.

That appears to be the road he's heading down in a round about way....

 

[Mikey the Flower Guy]

That appears to be the road he's heading down in a round about way....

Like a court finding his health reform bill as "unconstitutional" because it "forces" people against their will....

 

[Doug Munro]

That appears to be the road he's heading down in a round about way....

Your right on that one! As a Canadian I marvel how the United States is changing. It is ironic that as time goes by a country like China is moving closer to capitalism and The good ole USA is moving closer to socialism.

Trust me social programs are one thing we understand up here in Canada, everytime you turn around our government is finding a new way to redistribute wealth, I am just sorry to see the US going down this same road which leads to a bankrupt government ( if you don't belive this just take a look across the pond). But enough about politics....

 

[bootcampguy]

Your right on that one! As a Canadian I marvel how the United States is changing. It is ironic that as time goes by a country like China is moving closer to capitalism and The good ole USA is moving closer to socialism.
.....................

Trust me, we are "marveled" too........

 

[David Rohr]

Order Gatherers? Don't you realize that your own beloved FTD and TELEFLORA are OG's? I hate the wire service. You are thinking of going after the WRONG segment of the industry. Picture this: Every PROFESSIONAL florist in this country, for just one week, REFUSE all wire orders coming into their store. Can you imagine what a statement from independent florists that would make?

Do you realize that most of the OG's are MEMBERS of the wire service and are using the same exact technology that you are? They come flying into your shop over the Dove system or Mercury, or pick a network, and you rapidly grab the order, fill it for cents on the dollar and have someone run down the street to deliver it. Sounds like something I would l like to be doing...NOT!

Tom, you are in New Jersey. I don't know how long you have been in business, but do you remember a man by the name of MEOLA? He had a company named NIGHTMARES INC and he was systematically buying up geographical telephone listings all up and down the east coast, including the shop that my town was in. All of a sudden, I am getting calls from angry customers who didn't get flowers, got crappy flowers from me or were spoken to rudly on the telphone, and they were not my orders! I got a call from a close friend who told me the number they called, and it "appeared" to be a local number, but there is a term called "remote call forwarding" the phone company uses, and the YELLOW PAGES are the biggest culpret. When is the last time you opened up your Yellow Pages directory and looked up "Florist"? I bet you will see all the OG's waaaaay before you ever see your listing and then you see FULL PAGE ADVERTISEMENTS for 800Flowers who are STEALING business directly away from YOU, but collecting their 20% plus transfer/service charges, but thats ok? It's time we all sprouted some common sense and banded together to go after this. But I will take a guess here, that there are those florists out there who will say..."good, let the other shop go out of business, there will be more orders for me"...and that is so typical of an unprofessional florist.

What you can do about OG's? COMPLAIN TO YOUR STATES ATTORNEY GENERAL!!!! Write letters to your elected government officials and MAKE SOME NOISE!!!!!! Do you think YOUR state can afford to loose any more sales tax money that it already has? Do you think you are going to keep your competitive edge if the OG's are allowed to shove their hand in your back pocket and take your hard earned dollars away from you? Do you like someone coming in your back door at night and stealing? I say, get gusy, get mad and get even!

 

[Doug Munro]

Order Gatherers? Don't you realize that your own beloved FTD and TELEFLORA are OG's? I hate the wire service. You are thinking of going after the WRONG segment of the industry. Picture this: Every PROFESSIONAL florist in this country, for just one week, REFUSE all wire orders coming into their store. Can you imagine what a statement from independent florists that would make?

Do you realize that most of the OG's are MEMBERS of the wire service and are using the same exact technology that you are? They come flying into your shop over the Dove system or Mercury, or pick a network, and you rapidly grab the order, fill it for cents on the dollar and have someone run down the street to deliver it. Sounds like something I would l like to be doing...NOT!

Tom, you are in New Jersey. I don't know how long you have been in business, but do you remember a man by the name of MEOLA? He had a company named NIGHTMARES INC and he was systematically buying up geographical telephone listings all up and down the east coast, including the shop that my town was in. All of a sudden, I am getting calls from angry customers who didn't get flowers, got crappy flowers from me or were spoken to rudly on the telphone, and they were not my orders! I got a call from a close friend who told me the number they called, and it "appeared" to be a local number, but there is a term called "remote call forwarding" the phone company uses, and the YELLOW PAGES are the biggest culpret. When is the last time you opened up your Yellow Pages directory and looked up "Florist"? I bet you will see all the OG's waaaaay before you ever see your listing and then you see FULL PAGE ADVERTISEMENTS for 800Flowers who are STEALING business directly away from YOU, but collecting their 20% plus transfer/service charges, but thats ok? It's time we all sprouted some common sense and banded together to go after this. But I will take a guess here, that there are those florists out there who will say..."good, let the other shop go out of business, there will be more orders for me"...and that is so typical of an unprofessional florist.

What you can do about OG's? COMPLAIN TO YOUR STATES ATTORNEY GENERAL!!!! Write letters to your elected government officials and MAKE SOME NOISE!!!!!! Do you think YOUR state can afford to loose any more sales tax money that it already has? Do you think you are going to keep your competitive edge if the OG's are allowed to shove their hand in your back pocket and take your hard earned dollars away from you? Do you like someone coming in your back door at night and stealing? I say, get gusy, get mad and get even!

Great plan, only one drawback......Once again it will devastate consumer confidence in sending flowers, particularly for those that place unfulfilled orders.

We are not the only gifting option in town any more and the competition is fierce. Why as an industry would we do anything to chase consumers away. How long before someone on this board will suggest filling incoming wire orders with substandard product as a way to hurt the OG's. When that happens be sure you use a sharp knife when you cut off your nose to spite your face. it will hurt less that way.

I remember a few years back when FTD had communication issues over its Mercury network at Valentines Day. The press articles at the time mentioned FTD in passing, however the underlying message was about how many individuals did not have flowers delivered. Bad press for our industry all around.

As I have stated before, I do not agree in any way shape or form in deceptive marketing practices. However running with a plan that will hurt the consumer, and ultimately the retail florist would not be the first choice of any sound rational person in this industry to combat these practices.

 

[lori042499]

Doug, I have to agree that any plan that hurts the sender or recipient is short sighted on florists part at best...it follows through to the pattern that florists have established as being short sighted in their decisions...If we are to win this war, we need to concentrate on our own businesses and stop filling orders we cannot make money on..Cut the expenses that don't make us any money and services that we do not use or tie us to other services that lose us money..We need to let these companies know that we mean business by not subscribing to their madness, us hurting the consumer or sabotaging their orders isn't going to make anything better, it will make even us obsolete...then where will we be...we need to give up on the idea that orders will flow through machines and make us millions like magic and go out and get our own orders and make our own fans happy beyond words to ensure that our shops stay in existance....noone is going to save us but ourselves...