Website picture exchange?

[Sarah Botchick]

Someone will need to investigate copyright laws and releases will need to be signed. Could be major legal issues if not. Also, there comes a matter of "work for hire." If I understand copyright correctly (I am no lawyer), technically, the shop owner owns the design and the photograph, even if they didn't make the original piece OR take the picture... So there would have to be a check system to make sure there were no angry shop owners out there.

Also, how does the cross country issue work with copyright? FC is great because of members from three countries. But that means three different sets of copyright laws.

Sorry, don't mean to be a kill joy. I think the whole thing is a phenomenal idea. I just know how tricky copyright can be. Would need to get a real expert involved.

 

[Dazeal]

bahhh why pay? One of the secrets to life is to give unselfishly. When I find out someone uses one of my images, I feel good that I could help a real florist.. not whine like a baby and think of a way to sue them. (disclaimer - I do understand the reality of bad people stealing images and directly competing against them, that is unethical and bad, so I am not that naive)

Anywho... was doing an ad this morning and thought I'd share the base image with you. If you need it in 300 dpi for print, let me know.

I used this image to target 'we buy more local organic flowers than anyone around' market. Use it however you want.



p.s. thanks Heather - And nice work Amy on knowing what an amnesia rose is!

 

[santosdesigns]

Thank you for you AWESOME kindness!!! You Rock! I feel the same. If I can help in any way weather it's with pic's, advise, or anything for that matter, I am HERE.

 

[felicityflowers]

Someone will need to investigate copyright laws and releases will need to be signed. Could be major legal issues if not.

Could you elaborate further? I'm not quite sure what copyright has to do with this situation. The owner of the photo would technically be giving up rights to it if they gave it/sold it to another shop...you would think that would be a given. Or maybe I give people too much credit.

If someone was concerned about another shop using their work you would think they would choose not to participate. I don't see how there could be any legal ramifications.

 

[wildflowerschicago]

Not really sure how this will work...in terms of y'all always complaining about pictures being the same and original content....


Wouldn't this be making our own originals into cookie cutters, when 1000's of florists have access to the same pics?

Lori, I could be wrong, but if the downloader just changed the file name and the design name (prior to posting it on their own site), it would read as original content. If I am wrong, would someone please tell me!

Plus, I think the relatively small number of shops who would use this to download images (by comparison to WS images) would not be enough to impact a local search...but again, I could be wrong.

 

[Sarah Botchick]

Could you elaborate further? I'm not quite sure what copyright has to do with this situation. The owner of the photo would technically be giving up rights to it if they gave it/sold it to another shop...you would think that would be a given. Or maybe I give people too much credit.

If someone was concerned about another shop using their work you would think they would choose not to participate. I don't see how there could be any legal ramifications.

I am not a lawyer, but I have had to do research on copyright law for the websites I have worked on. You do not give up the rights unless you sign a release. Just giving the picture to someone does NOT give up the rights. COPYRIGHT IS NEVER AS EASY AS YOU THINK IT IS. Just spend 5 minutes on the government's copyright website, www.copyright.gov and you will see that it is very complicated.

For example, one website I did, the company paid a HUGE sum of money to a professional photographer to photograph their products. The company designed the product. YET, the PHOTOGRAPHER still owned the copyright. They released the images for SHARED copyright so that company could use the images on their website, yet the company had to credit the photographer and link to their website.

Again, I am not a lawyer. But I do understand that there are more legal issues than the average person realizes.

 

[felicityflowers]

For example, one website I did, the company paid a HUGE sum of money to a professional photographer to photograph their products. The company designed the product. YET, the PHOTOGRAPHER still owned the copyright. They released the images for SHARED copyright so that company could use the images on their website, yet the company had to credit the photographer and link to their website.

Again, I am not a lawyer. But I do understand that there are more legal issues than the average person realizes.

I understand where you are coming from. And I know copyright laws are insanely complicated. Wouldn't a simple creative commons license solve the problem?

 

[Sarah Botchick]

It is entirely possible... All I am saying is it would probably be good to talk to a copyright lawyer first. I know, that is expensive. But it could save a lot of money from a lawsuit down the road.

 

[Eric S]

Hey Shannon.

I didn't hit the groan button my post yesterday kept screwing up.

I don't know why but sometimes when I hit the post button i get an error. Same thing happens when I am betting on the Casino and I end up losing my my money!!!

 

[BOSS]

Same thing happens when I am betting on the Casino and I end up losing my my money!!!

That's not an error

 

[shannonlovesflowers]

So I asked Amy,

She said exactly what I said she say.

 

[lori042499]

bahhh why pay? One of the secrets to life is to give unselfishly. When I find out someone uses one of my images, I feel good that I could help a real florist.. not whine like a baby and think of a way to sue them. (disclaimer - I do understand the reality of bad people stealing images and directly competing against them, that is unethical and bad, so I am not that naive)

Anywho... was doing an ad this morning and thought I'd share the base image with you. If you need it in 300 dpi for print, let me know.

I used this image to target 'we buy more local organic flowers than anyone around' market. Use it however you want.



p.s. thanks Heather - And nice work Amy on knowing what an amnesia rose is!

love this rose, I am hoping my future sister in law likes it to...she has latte dresses and I think it will be gorgeous..

 

[goldfish]

I understand where you are coming from. And I know copyright laws are insanely complicated. Wouldn't a simple creative commons license solve the problem?

No, unfortunately.

Let's say Cathy posted one of their masterpieces. You paid her $$$ and posted it on your website. Some OG downloaded the Cathy's pic from your website withour paying a penny. He then started using the pic to earn money. Could happen.

I don't know how much $$$ Cathy & Co. has spent on photography, but it must be a lot just by looking at the quality. She has to protect her investment. There musy be some mechanism, both legal and technical, to protect the original copyright owner.

 

[felicityflowers]

No, unfortunately.

Let's say Cathy posted one of their masterpieces. You paid her $$$ and posted it on your website. Some OG downloaded the Cathy's pic from your website withour paying a penny. He then started using the pic to earn money. Could happen.

I don't know how much $$$ Cathy & Co. has spent on photography, but it must be a lot just by looking at the quality. She has to protect her investment. There musy be some mechanism, both legal and technical, to protect the original copyright owner.

Very true, but it wouldn't take a third party for that to happen and it's happened to Cathy before.

That could happen anywhere. Right now I've got the JH images on my site. I can't control who comes to my site and takes the images. There's no way for me to know if they stole them or if they bought them from JH.

But what does that have to do with a creative commons license? I'm confused...as usual.

 

[bloomz]

Not really sure how this will work...in terms of y'all always complaining about pictures being the same and original content....


Wouldn't this be making our own originals into cookie cutters, when 1000's of florists have access to the same pics?

BINGO!

Eggzactly what I am thinking reading this thread...

 

[goldfish]

Very true, but it wouldn't take a third party for that to happen and it's happened to Cathy before.

That could happen anywhere. Right now I've got the JH images on my site. I can't control who comes to my site and takes the images. There's no way for me to know if they stole them or if they bought them from JH.

JH is probably big enough to legally pursue the perpetrators.

But if a small biz invested ~$5,000 to take photographs and these photos were later stolen, lawsuit isn't a viable option, because it would cost more than the recoverable damage.

In the end, they would end up "allowing" the perpetrators to profit from their investment.

In other words, without protection, it may discourage those who have invested serious money in making photos, from participating in this movement.

But what does that have to do with a creative commons license? I'm confused...as usual.

Me, too.

 

[Knife's Wife]

Here is what I understand after having read much of the laws...

The photographer whether professional or not owns copy right to to what they photograph. They can give written permission to anyone they want to use the photos that they have taken. It is wise to protect yourself by getting this written statement for use of pictures so that owner of pics cannot later claim they did not give you permission.

You are not allowed by law to download, scan, copy any picture and use it for profit unless the owner of the picture has given permission.

Photos taken at work, on work time by an employee does not constitute ownership. Those pictures would be the property of the company and can be used and or distributed at the employers discretion.

When you pay a professional photographer to do photos for you, you still have to obtain permission to use their photos on your website.

When ever we have received photos from a brides photographer they have sent along a signed release of use with the photo cd or pictures.

You can file a law suit against anyone that has used photos without permission and the penalties for such use is huge.

If you have been given permission to use photos by a photographer you are not allowed to grant permission to any other user of said photo. That person must contact the owner of photo to be granted use.

Be careful when you tell some that they have permission to use any photo on your site unless you are the photographer or they were taken by an employee at work.


Joan

 

[SpringCity]

Hey you know what, those of us who are interested can just exchange photos amongst ourselves and that would work just fine too.
:>

 

[Knife's Wife]

I agree Spring!!

Contact me if there is any pic you would like to use from my site, I will even give you written permission to change the background.

Some of my photos are done by professionals so I do not have permission to distribute to others.


To address those who are concerned about the "everyone" having the same pics issue.

I really do not think that would be an issue as I would and I know others as well would use maybe a few photos from one shop and a few photos from others, and I doubt many of us would use all of the same photos available.

Randy, for example, has beautiful pics but many use components, containers, or materials that I may not want to offer or that I may feel do not sell well in my area, those pics, as beautiful as I may feel they are, are not practical for me, or may not be what I need at the time.

Disclaimer...Randy is used here only as an example because I know that he does much of his own work, if not all.

I have alot of photos that I do not use on my site, but others may find that it is something they may want to use on thier site. I also have pics that I did use on my site but do not carry the container any longer but some else here might. That is why I thought a central area to upload to would be a good idea as not all the pics I have and am willing to share are on the site.

I highly doubt that they would be many here that would find the same pics viable for them to make a difference on the big world web.


Joan

 

[Palms]

Was just about to post what robin and joan said but they beat me to it. I am up for some swapping even as an experiment.